331: What Running a Business Reveals About You with Maria Winters

Hi there. You’re listening to the Leading Lady Podcast. I’m your host, AliceAnne Loftus, and I’m a certified professional coach specializing in leadership and work-life balance. I work with clients to shift their limiting beliefs, insecurities, and self-doubt. This podcast will be filled with tools and strategies to help high-achieving women like you feel connected, empowered, and in the lead of your life, both personally and professionally. Let’s transform your life, starting now. Lead yourself. The rest will follow.

Hi there, leading ladies, and welcome to today’s episode. Today I am joined by a special guest, a dear friend, fellow Leading Lady ambassador, just an all-around amazing person to have in my life, Maria Winters. Maria is a licensed mental health therapist with over 20 years of experience supporting others in their emotional well-being. She is the founder and owner of The Coaching Therapist, an education practice that exists to humanize conversations around mental health and emotional wellbeing for midlife professionals who are committed to personal growth and the well-being of themselves and others. Maria co-hosts the podcast Wellness Rebranded with two of our other Leading Lady ambassadors, Elizabeth Harris and Tara de Leon, and she is the creator of the Emotional Fitness Studio that happens right here in Annapolis, Maryland. Maria, thank you for joining me today. I am really excited to get into our topic and just love having you in my life personally and professionally.

Entrepreneurship as a Mirror

Maria: Thank you for having me. And I love having you in my life too. So that’s good that we both love having each other in our life. That would suck if you would love to have me and I don’t love having you.

AliceAnne: So yeah, it is a mutual love.

Maria: It’s a mutual love. So love it.

AliceAnne: Maria, I actually love this topic that we’re going to talk about. And it’s about, how did you word it, things you’ve learned about yourself through your journey of entrepreneurship, or how running a business really highlights who you are?

Maria: Yes, yes. And I had no clue. I think five years into it, I think I opened my business five years ago. I think now opening my own business served as a mirror, or became a mirror that reflected both my strengths and all those things that I needed to work on, that I had no clue. I don’t think they would have come out if I wouldn’t have opened my own business.

AliceAnne: Yeah, I always say that being an entrepreneur is going to highlight and amplify every insecurity you’ve ever had, and it’s also going to show you how amazing you really are.

Maria: Yes. Yes. It amplifies both.

AliceAnne: You, like, oscillate between, I can do this too. Oh my gosh, I’m amazing. I can do this. It’s like the ultimate test of what you’re capable of.

Maria: Yeah, right. I mean, before I opened my own business, I was working under somebody else all the time. So many of the decisions didn’t have to come from me. We had those meetings where people were like, oh, good job to Maria for doing this or that. And then I found myself having my own business. I’m like, where’s the other person telling me, good job? Or where’s…

AliceAnne: Clapping, right?

Maria: Yes. Or worse, the other person, the ten. Other people I could go to, to make sure that the decision I’m about to make is the right decision, right? No. You know, or where’s my paycheck? No matter what I do, where’s my paycheck? Every month? Not happening. Not like this. But you’re right, it amplified a lot of insecurities that I had, but it also amplified that. I kind of knew that I was a really cool, hard worker and that I had a lot of talents. But girl, I know better now. I mean, I know them more clearly than before.

Always a Work in Progress

AliceAnne: I’ve been in business a really long time, and I love to look back at the different versions of AliceAnne I have been. You know, I started my first company in my 20s when I thought I knew everything. And now here I am in my 40s and I’m going, I don’t know anything.

Maria: Exactly. Yes. Bless our hearts. At age 20.

AliceAnne: Yeah. I thought, you know, you’re like bright-eyed, bushy-tailed, and you think you have all the answers, and then you get going and you realize there’s so much to learn. And I think what I’m most thankful for in my growth as a business owner is my willingness to learn. Because there is so much learning that needs to happen. And it’s humbling to be able to say, you know what? I don’t have all the answers. And I think really successful entrepreneurs are people that can say that, I don’t have all the answers. I’m a work in progress myself. I’m learning. I’m evolving. And so my business is going to go through phases of growth and evolution and learning.

Maria: Absolutely.

AliceAnne: What are you most grateful for in who you are through this?

Learning to Ask for Help

Maria: Actually, you’re making me think of different things. One, learning to embrace my vulnerability was huge. I had to learn to say, I have no idea how to do this, and I probably don’t need to figure it out alone. So let me go out and ask some other ladies how to do this. And that was actually what the Leading Lady community was for me. All these other women, like, girl, I already went through this, and you do it like this, this, and that. In fact, I’ll help you and we’ll do it right. And then with the learning, when I look back at five years ago, all the things that I didn’t know, that now I’m considering myself like a pro. I was like, girl, you’re a quick learner. And look at you, right? Things that you didn’t know, and now you can do them in your sleep. And it was because I, even though I was scared, I tried it anyway. I think the biggest learning, AliceAnne, was to be really scared to do something and do it anyway. I say, what’s the worst that could happen? That I end up in the same situation I’m in now? Okay, I can do that.

And having women. One perfect example of this is you and I meeting for a strategic planning session, and me talking about the Emotional Fitness Studio and telling you that idea that I had and how I wanted to do it, but I didn’t know how. And I was scared and I kept telling you, I don’t know how to ask for money, AliceAnne. I’m a therapist. We don’t ask for money or, you know, for investors or sponsors, and I don’t know how to do it. And you’re like, listen, you have two months to do it. Figure it out. Get out of here. These are ideas. Go do it. And I remember I left that meeting with a knot in my stomach. It was a mix of I’m about to quit everything and a mix of I can do this. I mean, somebody is challenging me to do something because she believes in this idea. And in those two months, my professional life kind of changed, because I’m like, you’re going to do this?

AliceAnne: It exploded.

Maria: It exploded. Like, you’re going to do this no matter what. You’re going to put your self-doubt in a drawer for two months. That’s it. Then it can come back, but just for two months, figure this out. And I was like, I wanted to come back to you and say, I did my homework. It was that nudge that I needed, like the teacher saying, you’re going to get a zero unless you complete this. I’m like, okay, okay, okay, I’ll do it. And that’s exactly what I needed, because it is hard to do it when you’re doing it alone, because that intrinsic motivation is hard to develop. Sometimes you do need that person behind you saying, you can do this, and I’m your accountability, and I’m going to check on you in two months, go do it. And that little pressure, I needed that.

Why the Right People Matter

AliceAnne: I love that, and it makes me think of two points. One, we have to be able to share our ideas with people who aren’t going to put them down, and this is why I love coaching, because a coach doesn’t have an agenda for you, you know? Yes, my life benefits because you’re in it. And yes, I love the Emotional Fitness Studio, but I had no real skin in the game for that. Right? As a coach, my goals are your goals, right? And I don’t have any other agenda for you. And oftentimes when we talk to our friends or our family, they want to keep us safe. And they don’t want us to take risks. And they might mean it with their whole heart, but they’re just trying to protect you. But sometimes they unintentionally deter you from dreaming big or imagining an opportunity or a possibility. Right? And a coach is a safe place to share your ideas, right? But it’s also really important that we have people in our life that remind us to believe in ourselves and remind us to believe in our dreams. And so maybe that’s a coach. Maybe that’s just a friend who’s supportive of anything you do. But I think most people in our life who really love us want to keep us safe. And they might unintentionally keep our dreams small.

Maria: I mean, we do it to ourselves, too.

AliceAnne: We do it to ourselves. We’re like, how many times is it, like, a great idea? But what if I fail?

Maria: Exactly.

AliceAnne: So just, what if?

Maria: What if it doesn’t?

AliceAnne: You know? And I think as a coach, it’s our job to say, but what if it does? What would it look like if you really believed in yourself? Right? And that goes to our communities that we’re in. Why it’s important to be with other people who are taking risks and dreaming big and putting themselves out there. Because when we see other people doing it, it builds our confidence as well.

Do It Scared

AliceAnne: And the second point, you said you’re going to do it scared. Have you heard of that? I’m sure you have. But there was like this movement of, be fearless, be fearless, be fearless, girl. And that never really resonated with me, because I think all emotions are important, and you’re the therapist here, but you probably taught me this. All emotions are important. So we never want to remove an emotion. We want…

Maria: You can’t.

AliceAnne: You can’t.

Maria: You can’t.

AliceAnne: Can’t. As hard as I tried, I will never.

Maria: Good luck with that. Good luck trying that. Never be fearless. There will always be something that scares me a little bit. But use that as a guide. You know, I often say do it scared. Fear does not mean that it’s wrong. It doesn’t mean that it’s not worth it. It doesn’t mean that it’s bad. And so if you’re feeling a little bit of fear and it’s still really important to you, then do it scared. And I love that you brought that up.

AliceAnne: How often are you scared in your business?

Maria: Gosh, every day. Almost all the time, it counts.

AliceAnne: Yes.

What Does “Ready” Even Mean?

Maria: And here’s the thing. Once you practice that, to do things scared, you learn how to listen to that scary feeling, because it’s information, right? All emotions bring information to you about yourself, but then you start evaluating what kind of scared am I going to pay attention to, and which ones deserve a “just do it”? Yes, do it scared. And once you practice that, you start a relationship with those feelings and say, yes, I am scared and it’s okay. I’m scared because this is important. I’m scared because I’m afraid to fail. I’m scared because, you know, there’s some stakes invested in this situation. But the more you practice it, the more you realize that the things that were stopping you before, now you have more control over them. Yeah. The other one that is very typical is the waiting to be ready. You know how long I was waiting to be ready? I don’t know, ready for what exactly? I was waiting to be ready. Like, I’ll open my business when I don’t know, there’s so many sentences to complete that. I’m ready when my kids are older. I’ll be ready when I go to more classes about how to open a business. I’ll be ready when I’m a therapist with more experience. I’ll have more to share with other people, and you can spend years waiting to be ready. What does that even mean?

AliceAnne: What does ready even mean, exactly?

Maria: Yeah, you don’t get ready. You become ready as you throw yourself in the water and start swimming while you’re still from the shore, saying, I’ll be ready when there’s less fish in that water. I’ll be ready when it looks a little less muddy. I’ll be ready when my bathing suit looks different. I don’t know, just throw yourself. And that was a friend of mine that told me that she owns this place in Madrid, in Spain. I was going there for vacation and she’s like, oh, since you’re coming, why don’t you speak at my space? It’s a beautiful space where people go and listen to different speakers. You can be the speaker. And I was like, me? Hell no. In Madrid. I don’t know anybody. Like, how are we going to sell tickets and what am I going to talk about? I have nothing to talk about. And she’s like, Maria, just throw yourself in the water and start swimming. What’s the worst that could happen? I mean, like, just swim. And I was like, that analogy in my head resonated a lot. And I’m like, you know what? Yes, I’m going to throw myself and we’ll see then if there’s sharks. If not, I’ll figure it out. And that speaking event, it really changed how I saw being ready. I’m like, no, I will never be ready. There’s so many excuses. Just do it. Not ready. Do it. Scared and not ready at all.

AliceAnne: Entrepreneurship is messy. Business is messy. No one really knows what they’re doing, because there’s so many variables that are out of our control. And I always say control is just an illusion. We really don’t have control over anything except our attitude and our effort, right? You know how we think about it and what we’re willing to take action upon. And I think that oftentimes we look at other people and we think, oh, they must have been ready. Maybe the risk wasn’t that big for them. It wasn’t as scary for them. Or I wish I could have it all figured out. Like, she has it all figured out. And I’m here to tell you, just pull the curtain back. Nobody knows what they’re doing.

Maria: I agree.

AliceAnne: Everyone’s scared. Everyone is not ready, or no one is ready. And a couple of double negatives there. But just focus on yourself. Look at the tools that you have, that you have equipped yourself with. Be open to learn. Know that you’re going to make mistakes. And then just go for it. Go for it. But you need that support system. You need the people that are going to…

Maria: Oh, yes. Yes.

Maria: But if you don’t throw yourself out there, it’s also hard to find that support system.

AliceAnne: Yeah.

Redefining Success

Maria: Because you’re going to find it as you go. Because as you start asking and figuring things out, then somebody comes out and says, yes, I know how to do it. Or putting yourself out there, going to those networking events or talking to people. I mean, talking to people and meeting people for me has been life-changing, personally and professionally. But I know so many women that are scared, naturally, of even putting themselves out there and saying, I need help, or I want to start talking to different people to see what comes up. So it’s all of it. It’s really going out there and trying different things. Some are going to work and some will not. But as you were saying, the other side of the coin that you made me think of is also, in my case, I learned even how to redefine success. Yes, I was going to make a lot of mistakes and many things are not going to go well. But the way I define my success right now is different than when I, before I started my business, because success was this big thing, you know, Maria, with a lot of money traveling the world, I don’t know what it was. But now, just the fact that six months ago I couldn’t do something and I do it better now, that’s success. The very first podcast I recorded with you, way before I opened my own business, that was who knows?

AliceAnne: It was during Covid. It was almost seven years ago.

Maria: That is true.

AliceAnne: That is true. During Covid.

Maria: And I was so nervous, I was shaking. And again, the first thought was like, I have nothing to share. What am I going to talk about in that podcast? And I’m going to hate listening to myself afterwards. AliceAnne, look at all I’ve been through. Right now it’s just a chat with a friend. And yes, I have things I can share. And if I don’t, well, then there’s that. Okay, move to the next episode. I don’t know, like, yeah. And that success. That wouldn’t have come without exposure, right? Exposure to that. I could have just said, no, AliceAnne, thank you so much, but no thank you. I’m not ready. I was not ready.

AliceAnne: That was a good episode. I think about it a lot. We will do a replay of that.

Maria: It was a good episode. It would be lovely to compare the sound of my voice then and now. Actually, I’m going to look at that.

The Woman by the Stairs

AliceAnne: I’m thinking about this woman. She joined the collective maybe five years ago. Yeah, because I’m going into my sixth year. And so she came and visited the collective and she stood by the stairs by the door. So in our building, you know, the stairs are right by the door. And I had never seen her before. And I walked over and I introduced myself and she was really shy and she said, I don’t know if I belong here. I said, what? She’s like, well, I’m a baby business. Like, I’m just getting started. And I don’t even know if, like, my business is real. She’s like, I don’t know that I belong here. And I threw my arms up and grabbed her. It was so aggressive, now that I think about it. I’m hugging her. I’m like, you absolutely belong here. And she let me know recently that she has now scaled her business to multiple six figures. And she’s on track to hit seven figures next year. And she has helped other women apply for grants and get access to money in their business. She has a full team now. She has people who are interested, other investors that have asked her if she would be interested in franchising. I mean, so much has changed.

Maria: Right?

AliceAnne: And so when you talk about defining success, for her, she’s like, I have all of these opportunities. But the success for me, and she listed off the successes, that she was able to start this business in the second chapter of her life. You know, she’s over 50 years old, which I think is still young, like we can do incredible things, but super young. But her success is that she grew something. She just grew something. Right? And so all of these other metrics of how much money she makes and all, you know, people wanting to buy the business now and all the things. And I’m like, well, what does the success really feel like? And she’s like, the success for me is that I had an idea and I put it out into the world, and I believed in myself. And I joined a community where I was able to help other women believe in themselves. And I’m like, oh my gosh.

Maria: You’re right. That is success. Showing up that day at that meeting was success. Just showing up and saying, I don’t think I belong here, and actually verbalizing that. It’s success. I love it.

AliceAnne: I’m so glad I saw her standing by the stairs, because I wonder, you know, those meetings can get a little crazy. Networking. And this is why I say it’s so important that we try and greet and talk to every single woman who comes into this space, because you never know. She might be standing by the stairs going, I don’t know if I belong here.

The Messages We Didn’t Grow Up With

Maria: No, no, I said it. During our last meeting, I recorded something that I put on my Instagram. I’m like, today I’m going to be that woman that I needed in those moments that I was new at an event, and that I felt, I have been that woman in a corner thinking, I don’t know what to talk about. Like, look at all these women knowing each other and having their businesses. What am I doing here? I’ve been that woman. And how amazing is it to have another woman just approach and say, you belong here. How are you? Welcome. And make you feel safe, and yes, we need to do that more, actually, among women. Because the other thing you made me think of when you were sharing that, AliceAnne, and it makes me sad, at least for me, is that I didn’t grow up listening to messages that I could do anything I wanted, that I could have my own business, that I could become the CEO of whatever if I wanted to. I didn’t grow up with that message, and I’m sure many women didn’t either. So it’s almost like we’re giving ourselves the inner voice or the messages that we didn’t receive growing up. And so, talking about personal work, the amount of personal work that I have had to do after opening my business is, I mean, it was like therapy, you know. The things that I have discovered about myself and that I need to work on, and to expand these other areas, is priceless. I wouldn’t have gone through it without opening my business, like I said before. So even the messages that we tell ourselves had to change too.

AliceAnne: Yeah, absolutely. And it’s just a beautiful discovery.

Self-Doubt and Vulnerability

AliceAnne: So you talk about how being a business owner is like holding up a mirror to yourself. What have you seen? What would you say have been the biggest things that you’ve seen and learned about yourself?

Maria: Oh, I didn’t know I had so much self-doubt until I opened my business. That was like, girl, here’s the mirror. Like, it’s loud. Yes, it was loud and I had no idea. Okay. I thought I was this feisty Maria that was capable of everything. And the second I opened my own business, it was a different kind of self-doubt. Because now it was me, with me, me, myself, and I. And I thought I knew how to give myself support before. But now when I’m in the car shaking before a big speaking event, I’ve learned to be that person giving me support and say, you can do this. You’ve done it many times. Remember, this isn’t that. And then I feel like I’m my own push in my back to get out of the car. I’m like, come on, girl, what are you doing? Get out there and do what you know what to do. I had to learn to do that. And I think what I said before is, the way I love my vulnerability now completely changed my life. I was working so hard on showing myself as the Maria that didn’t need help, the Maria that knew it all, the Maria that was so strong. Absolutely not. I have so many needs and I need so much help every day. And I need the support. I cannot do it alone. Accepting that and letting it out and actually loving it.

AliceAnne: It was an instant connection with other humans.

Maria: Oh my goodness. Why was I wasting my time trying to show that I was so strong? I’m not. I mean, I am, but you know what I mean.

AliceAnne: Yeah, I experienced that when I wrote my first book, Take the Lead. And the book was really just cathartic for me. Like, I just wanted to tell my story, but I freaked out. I was like, oh my gosh, everyone is going to see all the cracks in me and all the bumps and bruises and faults, and people are going to hate my guts. They’re going to see me and they’re going to be like, that is a very broken woman. And if anyone felt that or thought that, I’ve never heard it.

Maria: And I don’t think anybody did. That’s the point.

AliceAnne: No, but the number of calls, emails, texts, people that stop me in random places to say, oh my gosh, I’ve read your book and I love you. Thank you. Thank you for saying that out loud. Writing that and being vulnerable and showing the mess. And I felt that vulnerability. It just opened me up in ways that I never could have imagined.

Maria: To others and to yourself.

AliceAnne: And to myself. I loved myself. I said I didn’t see myself as broken anymore. I saw myself as whole, human, and lived. And when you accept that vulnerability, it is self-love. That I’m still, I’m worthy. Not still worthy. I’m just worthy.

Maria: You know, and like you said, I have needs. I’m worthy of those needs. I’m worthy of having those needs met as well.

AliceAnne: And it’s like a weight lifted, because, you know, the effort that it takes to show up in the world, not exactly as you are, with your strengths and your cracks and all of that. And the feeling of being accepted and loved by people who see your cracks because you’re actually showing them and saying, these are my cracks, FYI. And they still think you’re amazing. It’s an amazing feeling. It’s lovely.

Maria: Yeah. It’s lovely. Way less work too.

Focusing on the Yeses Instead of the Nos

AliceAnne: I will say, early in my business, I used to be so afraid of all the nos. I used to get so down about who would unsubscribe or didn’t follow me, or who didn’t hire me, or who left a program. And I would say more recently, I’m focusing on all the yeses. I’m focusing on the people that show up. I’m focusing on the people that say, this is awesome and I want to be part of it. Right? And I don’t know what caused that shift. Like, what’s that all about?

Maria: I mean, it is a shift, because remember, naturally, biologically, we’re trained to focus on the negative, on what’s not working. It’s like when you see those influencers or whoever has social media and they get the one negative comment that is so hurtful, and then they make a whole video of that comment just because they need to reply to that comment. But we’re not making videos of the other 3,000 people that left a beautiful comment about it. Right? So then in a way, it’s not fair to the other 2,000 who are there, because we’re [unclear]. Exactly. And because we’re going to focus on the people who are loud and making a lot of noise negatively. Yeah. Because it hurts. But when you shift that focus to what’s working, and again, redefining success, that’s just a feather. We can’t make those things bricks. It has to be feathers, because really the bricks are the other 1,000 that are there, right? So it’s a change in mindset, but also in what you’re paying more attention to, which at the end is not even helpful. But it’s like, again, if you’re looking beautiful and you’re wearing an amazing outfit and you feel amazing, but then is that little wrinkle next to your eye the one that you’re going to focus on before you leave to that event? Girl, focus. I mean, that’s a feather. That is a feather.

AliceAnne: Yeah. So I’ve learned that I’ve had to do a lot of mindset work as a business owner, that I had to unlearn a lot of behaviors. Oh, this is so good. I think we could talk about this all day.

What Success Really Is

Maria: I know, but it’s beautiful. And I think the message for any woman out there, I think, is, you know what? Do it scared. You’re not the only one going through this. Every single woman walking around, or every single human, has those fears. The difference is, what do we do with those fears? We’re not going to not have them. It’s like you said, the control that we have is in the attitude and what we do, right? Our response to those emotions. And that any opportunity, at whatever age, that we have to get to know ourselves better and do the real personal work with the goal of accepting yourself more, liking yourself a little more, designing the life that you want and you deserve. Understanding that that life you want, you also deserve, it is worth the effort.

AliceAnne: All that work is worth the effort.

Maria: Yeah, that is success.

AliceAnne: That is success. Being able to show up fully as you. And embracing all the lessons that you’ve learned along the way. That is success.

Maria: I agree.

How to Connect with Maria

AliceAnne: Yeah, I agree. All right. So how can our listeners get connected with you?

Maria: Well, like you said, I have a podcast with Tara and Elizabeth. It’s called Wellness Rebranded. You can listen to it on any of the platforms. You can find me on Instagram, coaching_therapist. And please learn more, if you’re in the Annapolis area, about the Emotional Fitness Studio. You’re going to find that on my website, thecoachingtherapist.com, and it’s a great place to come learn about yourself more. It’s free, in-person wellness events every month, more than once a month. A schedule comes out in January. So it’s really an emotional gym, a place to come learn about different things in community. And I would love to see you there, or with the podcast, or anywhere. And thank you.

AliceAnne: The Emotional Fitness Studio, you’re getting ready to go into your fourth year.

Maria: Isn’t that crazy?

AliceAnne: That’s crazy. That’s wonderful, fantastical.

Maria: I know, that makes me so happy. You have no idea. After my kids, this is like the biggest accomplishment. Like, I can die tomorrow after.

AliceAnne: Don’t say that. But you feel very fulfilled.

Maria: I’ll die in peace. That I did something big and awesome.

AliceAnne: Yeah, but Maria also goes into businesses and corporations, and she can help you with mental support, mental wellness within your organization. I have used her within my companies. She is fantastic and such a great resource. We need to support the wellness of others in our organizations. You know, we’re only as good as our people, and our people are only as good as the support they have, right? You know, they…

Maria: They…

AliceAnne: Need that. So I just love you, Maria. I love what you’re doing. I love that you are so passionate about this and that you’re bringing it to light, that our mental health matters, our mental wellness matters. And you are just abundant in resources. So thank you.

Maria: And I love you back, and thank you for all your support since day one. I could not have done it without support, and you are a big part of that. So thank you for ever and ever, until the day I do die.

AliceAnne: She brings up death a lot, but okay.

Until next time, take the lead. Thanks for tuning in for another episode of the Leading Lady Podcast. You can find all of the links and information mentioned in this episode at www.leadinglady-coaching.com. If you enjoyed this episode, don’t forget to follow the show so you don’t miss any future episodes. And while you’re there, it would mean the world to me if you would take a few seconds and leave me an honest review. This will allow me to help other high-achieving women find inspiration, connection, and develop strategies to live and lead with purpose and intention. See you here next week.